After the trade-visa-for-property proposal to non-EU citizens, Greece is considering to expand its attractive offers and lure EU citizens to invest in Greece. This time, Athens targets citizens of European Union member-countries and thus aged over 60 or 65 years old.
According to in.gr, the Finance Ministry considers to offer to these EU ‘investors’ tax incentives, if they buy a summer house in Greece.
These pensioners will not have their retirement income taxed in Greece, even if they stay in Greece longer than 183 days (it looks as if EU pensioners staying longer than 183 days have their pension taxed here.)
However, they will not be eligible to work in Greece.
At this stage, the ministry considers to apply this lucrative measure fro pensioners over 60 or 65 years old.
The plan will be discussed tomorrow, Friday, among members of the relevant committee in charge of the changes in the tax system.
So probably there will be more details tomorrow.
Here I have to note:
1) This is a 100% discrimination against Greek pensioners. What tax incentives do they get?
2) This is 100% discrimination against EU pensioners, who have already purchased summer house here.
3) EU pensioners with 60? Didn’t the Troika with Christine Lagarde on the lead claiming that only Greeks would retire quite early when compared to other EU citizens?
Do not get me wrong. But will we have here EU citizens living here, being taxed there (possible with lower tax rates) while the rest of us will give the state more than 45% of our incomes?
Where is the famous EU Commission, the EU Parliament and all the other EU bodies promoting Eguality Rights to EU citizens? Where is the EU to protect Greeks from being discriminated against other EU citizens and thus by their own state?
PS I think this 183-days (6 months) limit answers also the question posed to me by some EU expats who were asked in 2012 to tax their retirement money in Greece. Bingo! Hopefully they have solved these issues.
We still get taxed in the UK and in Greece. My husband is on a disability pension that is paid into a bank in the UK. He pays tax at source.
But we still have to pay taxes here in Greece as well because we are resident here, even though we earn no money here and have no income from Greece. We had to pay the ‘imputed tax’ like everyone else did.
Just like the Greeks , we are covered for IKA but are having to pay our own medical fees and prescription charges in full.
probably you’re pension-taxed here because you permanently live here.
No, the UK pension is taxable in UK. Janet & her husband are paying Greek tax on their ‘imputed’ (assumed) income based on the size of their property, car, (& boat & pool if they have them) because they live there fill time. Those of us with part time homes in Greece do not pay Greek tax as long as we are there less than 6 months in a tax year &, of course, have no Greek income. Of course we do have to pay the property tax and ‘dimarkeio’ tax included with the electricity bill (but for most this is cheap compared with UK council tax) and purchase taxes (VAT equiv.) on all the things we buy when in Greece. I can see that it is good for Greece if we spend our UK earned income & pensions on Greek goods and services.
Sorry typing error ‘full time’!
thanks for making clear about the UK/taxed pension and what’s is the tax paid here (due to property etc).
S.Cook – If they live in Greece in full time they should not be paying UK taxes, see link below
Janet
It is illegal for you to be taxed twice
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/taxtreaties/in-force/1953-greece-dtc.pdf
Either you are taxed in the UK or Greece, not both.
As pensioners from the UK, we pay income tax at source on our UK state pension,as part of the EU reciprocal tax agreement but pay tax in Greece on our private pension. We also do not have any income earned in Greece, but feel privileged to be allowed to live in this wonderful country and if our contribution, however small it may be, we are proud to do so.
It’s all very confusing!!!!Everyday we hear somewhere something different – all these incentives and ideas and changes in this, that & the other are changing on a daily basis it seems. Just when you get used to one system it changes.
Greece is caught by a wave of ‘reforms’ and ‘structural reforms’ in order to be an example country.THE perfect country of the globe, like Germany.
If I can put a different spin on your story. This kind of measure has massive potential to raise the value of properties in Greece which would benefit all Greek homeowners. Not to mention bringing disposable cash into the country.
be my guest 🙂
Isn’t it enough that our UK funded pension is taxed in the UK?
We (EU ex-pats) pay VAT 23%/13% purchase tax on everything we buy here, tax on petrol, electric, mobile phones, OTE, car tax and water, property tax etc. is paid to the Greek government!?
If I live here I feel the above is fair, especially as the UK taxpayer is paying my pension and Greece still gets plenty of cash from me too!!!
“UK taxpayer is paying my pension” I thought pensions are based on workers’ contributions, not in UK?
No, in reality the contributions that were made allegedly towards final pension by workers were in fact already spent by government on pensioners at that time. It’s my children and your (UK) children paying for pensioners now! Governments don’t put the money in a ‘piggy bank’ for us..they spend it!!
it’s normal everywhere in the world that younger generations’ contributions are used to pay the pensions of the former generation. However times of high unemployment and consiquently less contributions create problems in pensions payments.
Elizabeth – They spend our pensions contributions but that is not the agreement. It is supposed to be for us. The government and the citizens would be better off if the government was not involved. People would save meaning they could profit from the money they put aside. The government uses the “cash flow” of pension contributions to run up extra debt meaning not only do you not get interest on the money you put aside for your pension you ending up having to pay interest on the government’s debt. Its a ludicrous situation.
P.S. the retirement/state pension age for both men and women in the UK is currently 65 years. This will be rising to 67 by 2016.
it maybe different in some other countries maybe…
It is all part of the population replacement goal of the EU (German Controlled) and the IMF.
To replace Greeces population with mostly Germans.
Some one should start reading SUN TSU`s “Art of War”. The Germans and Anglo Saxons sure have and are making the best out of it.
I had a conversation not that long ago with a German, who is just an average worker. He earns about 1500 Euro per month nett. But told me that when he retires he expects to have enough money to live very comfortably in Spain. While it is cheaper for him to rent a whole house and have someone come once a week to clean. And enjoy fresh air, sunshine and good natural food.
a healthy mediterranean diet, indeed 🙂
In the US, retirement age is 65 for those born in 1937 or earlier. They’re mostly dead. Then there is a scale based on the year of your birth. For me, born in 1951, it is 66. For anyone born after 1960, it is 67. It has been that way since 1983.
thanks for the info, Jodi.
If I move to greece permantly…with only my UK state pension. Buy a house & pool from the proceeds of my house sale. What taxes do I have to pay? I have no private pension.
to tell you the truth I could not give you exact information righ tnow, as the taxation law is currently under revision. Maybe in a month or so it will be finalized.
Forgot to ask…would I have to take a new driving test long term? & I understand I would need full health insurance!!(What are the costs?)
no idea. sorry.
Under EU law you can simply swap your UK driving licence for any other EU driving licence. If you have one of the newer ones, it actually says “European Communities” model on it somewhere, and says it’s a driving licence in 27 languages or so.
If you have an older UK licence, do yourself a big favour, “lose” it and apply for a new one in the UK. You’ll then get a new model, valid all over the EU.
If you have a UK pension, you should also have UK health insurance. What you need is an E111 form (or the equivalent) which allows you to bring your health cover with you. There is EU legislation in the pipeline to regulate the health care shambles that exists, and that is expected to come in next year. Mind you, there isn’t too much health care left here… At present some 100 medicines are rather hard to get, including some stuff for diabetics etc.
The only reason you need to prove you have health insurance is to register in Greece. You can get private international health care anywhere, as long as you are willing to pay a small forutne for it. You need to register if you want to buy property, car, bike, etc. Unless of course you play the announced government game of investing in property as a “retired” EU citizen. Then you might just get a residency permit, without having to jump through 20 million hoops before you can buy a bike or car or house. It will cost you 300.000€, plus of course legal fees 🙂 An E111 might just be a tadd cheaper…
And now they need Drachma to finish the picture they are painting the last years: Former “Gastarbeiter” have to sell their houses they were working two shifts in Germoney for to their former slave drivers.