Russian Su-24 & Airspace violations: Why Greece and Turkey do not shoot down each other’s fighter jets

On the occasion of the shooting down of the Russian Su-24 jet by Turkey, there are quite some people – Greeks and expats living in Greece – wondering what it seems to be the obvious:  why is not there has been downing similar airplane either from Greece or from Turkey during the 17-year long history of the famous Greek-Turkish  so-called “dogfights”.

“Dogfights” describes the practice where Greek F-16 and Mirage fighter jets and Turkish mostly F-16s get involved in dangerous flight maneuvers chasing each other. The practice is to understand as tactical military provocations triggered by Turkish fighter jets to challenge Greece’s national and airspace sovereignty over the Aegean Sea. At times, the fighter jests are armed.

The “dog fights” normally take place mostly over the Greek islands of Lesvos, Chios, Samos and Kos in the East and the Aegean Sea. Every foreign tourist who has spent a couple of days or weeks on one of these and other islands of the Dodecanesse group has wondered about the war airplanes chasing each other over their heads.

While at times the Turkish violations of Greek FIR are daily, there are occasions that Greek fighter jets cross Turkish airspace especially in the area opposite of the island of Kos or Chios. This has mostly to do with technical reasons because the Greek fighter jets chase Turkish jets to oust them from Greek FIR they have to do a maneuver “fly a big half circle” in order to return to Greece.

Video: dogfight caught in F-16 radar

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Video: Greek Mirage 2000 intercepts Turkish F-16

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Neither Greece nor Turkey has ever officially accepted violation of the airspace of the neighboring country. The common practice is that the General Staffs of both countries just issue statements saying that fighter jets of the other country violated the national airspace.

Occasionally the dog fights end in casualties on both sides and there is only one incident that has been alleged that a Turkish plane was accidentally shot down by a Greek one.

“The incident occurred in 1996 and it was first described as an accident. In 2004, a Greek newspaper published claims that the Turkish plane had unintentionally been shot down by the Greek one. The shootdown was confirmed by the Turkish government but denied by the Greek side.”

In another dogfight involvement in 2006, a Turkish F-16 and a Greek-F-16 collided midair. The pilot of the Turkish plane survived but the Greek pilot died.

“One of the routine interception maneuvers led to a fatal accident on 23 May 2006. Two Turkish F-16s and one reconnaissance F-4 were flying in the international airspace over the southern Aegean at 27,000 feet (8,200 m) without having submitted flight plans to the Greek FIR authorities. They were intercepted by two Greek F-16s off the coast of the Greek island Karpathos. During the ensuing mock dog fight, a Turkish F-16 and a Greek F-16 collided midair and subsequently crashed. The pilot of the Turkish plane survived the crash, but the Greek pilot died.”

Speaking with Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov on Wednesday, Greek Foreign Minister Nikos Kotzias expressed Greece’s solidarity about the shooting down of the Su-24 fighter bomber the previous day. Kotzias reportedly mentioned also “1,500 Greek airspace violations committed by Turkey on a yearly basis.”

According to Al Monitor, “In the first month of 2014, Turkish jets violated Greek airspace 1,017 times. That is twice the total number of violations in the first six months of 2013.”

There have been many times when radars of Turkish fighter jets have “locked” the Greek air-fighters for as long as 3 minutes. Turkey shot the Russian Su-24 that flew  over Turksih airspace for 15 seconds. Also Greek jets’ radars ‘lock’ Turkish jets but no plane has shot down the jet that has violated the airspace. At least, not intentionally.

On the occasion of the Russian incident on Tuesday, now some hot-headed nationalist Greeks wonder why Athens does not shoot down Turkish jets when they violate Greek airspace and reply to Turkey with the same argumentation Ankara used to justify the shooting down of the Russian airplane, that is “in defense of its  national sovereignty.”

Respectively there could be also some hot-headed nationalist Turks asking Ankara to apply the “defend sovereignty via shooting down violators” formula to all flying intruders.

However there is one important point thus a crucial one that makes the big difference between the Russian incident of Tuesday and the Greek-Turkish dogfights. the situation of the borders between Turkey & Syria and Turkey & Greece.

Greece and Turkey, both are members of the NATO, they are allies that are theoretically not allowed to shoot down each other’s airplanes.

Of course, there have been several conflicts between the two countries that brought them on the verge of a war (Imia/Kardak crisis in 1996) and it was then US-President Bill Clinton who personally intervened to diffuse the crisis. The previous serious conflict between Turkey and Greece was when Ankara invaded Cyrpus in 1974 and Greece sent armed forces to help the Cypriot brothers.

One more reason that Greek or Turkish air space violations are dealt with dogfights and not with shooting down each other’s planes is that Greece belongs to the European Union and that Athens can claim its right to turn a conflict with a non-EU member into a European one.

Not that Turkey would care much about such an issue. In recent past, Ankara had  issued warnings of its airspace violations against flying patrols of the Frontex.

Turkish incidents with Frontex

1) In September 2009, a Turkish military radar issued a warning to a Latvian helicopter patrolling in the eastern Aegean—part of the EU’s Frontex programme to combat illegal immigration—to leave the area. The Turkish General Staff reported that the Latvian Frontex aircraft had violated Turkish airspace west of Didim.

According to a Hellenic Air Force announcement, the incident occurred as the Frontex helicopter—identified as an Italian-made Agusta A109—was patrolling in Greek air space near the small isle of Farmakonisi, which lies on a favorite route used by migrant smugglers.

Frontex officials stated that they simply ignored the Turkish warnings as they did not recognise their being in Turkish airspace and continued their duties.

2) Another incident took place on October 2009 in the aerial area above the eastern Aegean sea, off the island of Lesbos.

3) On 20 November 2009, the Turkish General Staff issued a press note alleging that an Estonian Border Guard aircraft Let L-410 UVP taking off from Kos on a Frontex mission had violated Turkish airspace west of Söke.

But shooting down? Turkey wouldn’t dare to shoot down a Frontex helicopter. Turkey could and believes it can shoot down airplanes coming from its northern, eastern and south borders which are also the external NATO borders. But it can never down a flying object coming from the West. Ankara can play wolf with the “pariahs states” but not with the West itself.

For more details see also: Greece – Turkey Aegean dispute

PS I suppose after the 3 incidents in 2009, Turkey finally understood that it cannot mess up with the Frontex.